Nuxx:2d1c9d66-cf63-41c5-b3d0-e5db6fe2f43d@o18g2000yqi.googlegroups.com

Path: num2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!num1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!number.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!postnews.google.com!o18g2000yqi.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail Message-ID: <2d1c9d66-cf63-41c5-b3d0-e5db6fe2f43d@o18g2000yqi.googlegroups.com> From: Nuxx Bar  Newsgroups: uk.rec.cycling Subject: OT: "How speed cameras have cost 'up to 10,000 lives'" Date: Sun, 24 May 2009 01:24:32 -0700 (PDT) Lines: 74 Organization: http://groups.google.com NNTP-Posting-Host: 81.156.251.27 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1252 Content-Transfer-Encoding: quoted-printable X-Trace: posting.google.com 1243153473 25077 127.0.0.1 (24 May 2009 08:24:33 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Sun, 24 May 2009 08:24:33 +0000 (UTC) Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com Injection-Info: o18g2000yqi.googlegroups.com; posting-host=81.156.251.27; posting-account=7_6kYAkAAABD6HrjM0VxehwvZOKMxm4g User-Agent: G2/1.0 X-HTTP-UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 5.1; en-GB; rv:1.9.0.10) Gecko/2009042316 Firefox/3.0.10 (.NET CLR 3.5.30729),gzip(gfe),gzip(gfe) Bytes: 4923 Xref: perfectly-safe.chapmancentral.co.uk uk.rec.cycling:703549

Cameras have cost lives. Ergo, those who have had a hand in forming camera policy, while knowing perfectly that they were costing lives, are murderers by proxy. Apparently such scum believe that killing thousands of people will be worth it in the long run because so many motorists will have been bullied off the roads. Funny how they're so coy about admitting to thinking that. (Did someone say "Chapman"?)

The trolls *hate* it when stats like the below are quoted, and have even started vicious hate campaigns against those who have done so in the media too often. Strange, really: why start a hate campaign against someone if they're really talking nonsense? Wouldn't it be obvious, negating the need for such campaigns? Almost as if the trolls know that in reality, stuff like the below is *bang on*, and they're desperate to stop it getting out because they want public support for their beloved anti-motorist cameras to remain. (Thankfully, they've failed miserably, considering that 80-90% of people in the UK oppose cameras, and the percentage of reasonably intelligent people who oppose cameras is even higher.)

http://www.express.co.uk/posts/view/100678/EXCLUSIVE-How-speed-cameras-have= -cost-up-to-10-000-lives-

THE battle to slash road deaths using speed cameras was exposed as a sham last night as figures showed thousands of lives could have been saved =ADwithout them.

A study claimed that 10,000 men, women and children killed in motoring accidents might still be alive if speed traps had been scrapped in favour of more traffic police.

Campaigners last night hit out at the Government=92s flawed road-safety policy and pointed to the vast reduction in patrol numbers since Labour came to power in 1997.

Figures reveal the rate at which deaths have fallen has slowed signif=AD icantly since 1995 when the controversial speed cameras came in.

Between 1980 and 1995 UK road death rates were falling 7.1 per cent a year. But since speed cameras arrived, deaths have fallen just 2.8 per cent annually. Experts say that if the pre-1995 rate had continued 9,674 lives could have been saved.

Last week the Government was accused of using speed cameras as a =93cash cow=94 after it was revealed that the Treasury raked around =A3100million a year in fines.

The damning road-death figures, seen by the Daily Express, were compiled by independent pressure group Transport Watch and based on Department for Transport statistics. Transport Watch director Paul Withrington, said: =93If they had done nothing to change the existing policy before speed cameras and road humps were brought in we would have had thousands of lives saved.=94

Between 1980 and 1995, UK deaths per billion vehicle miles fell from around 22 to about nine without speed cameras and road humps.

From 1995 to 2007 Government figures show the death rate fell from nine to six, a reduction of just three deaths in 12 years compared with a drop of 13 in the previous 15 years.

A recent survey found that there were 4,309 speed cameras in the UK and just 1,904 police traffic patrol cars =96 2.2 cameras for every vehicle.

Brian Gregory of the Association of British Drivers said the figures proved speed cameras didn=92t help save lives. Labour has presided over a 20 per cent fall in traffic police. Adrian Tink of the RAC Foundation said: =93We would like to see more =ADtraffic police. They are a more useful deterrent against careless driving than cameras.=94

The Department for Transport said: =93We=92ve cut the number of =ADpeople killed or seriously injured on the roads each year by more than a third since the mid-1990s. That means almost 17,000 fewer deaths or serious injuries in a year.=94