Nuxx:6ea8bd3b-ff2f-4227-98f7-a5e457545b20@u69g2000hse.googlegroups.com

Path: number1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border1.nntp.dca.giganews.com!border2.nntp.dca.giganews.com!nntp.giganews.com!news.glorb.com!postnews.google.com!u69g2000hse.googlegroups.com!not-for-mail Message-ID: <6ea8bd3b-ff2f-4227-98f7-a5e457545b20@u69g2000hse.googlegroups.com> From: Nuxx Bar  Newsgroups: uk.rec.cycling Subject: Reasonable? Necessary? You Decide Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2008 04:30:52 -0800 (PST) Lines: 95 Organization: http://groups.google.com NNTP-Posting-Host: 85.211.165.120 Mime-Version: 1.0 Content-Type: text/plain; charset=windows-1256 Content-Transfer-Encoding: 7bit X-Trace: posting.google.com 1203769856 21915 127.0.0.1 (23 Feb 2008 12:30:56 GMT) X-Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com NNTP-Posting-Date: Sat, 23 Feb 2008 12:30:56 +0000 (UTC) Complaints-To: groups-abuse@google.com Injection-Info: u69g2000hse.googlegroups.com; posting-host=85.211.165.120; posting-account=7_6kYAkAAABD6HrjM0VxehwvZOKMxm4g User-Agent: G2/1.0 X-HTTP-UserAgent: Mozilla/5.0 (Windows; U; Windows NT 6.0; en-GB; rv:1.8.1.12) Gecko/20080201 Firefox/2.0.0.12,gzip(gfe),gzip(gfe) Bytes: 6023 X-Original-Bytes: 5980 Xref: perfectly-safe.chapmancentral.co.uk uk.rec.cycling:641310

I'll come up with a complete list of anti-motorist measures when I've got time (because it will take a while).

But for now, I would like people (particularly Spindrift and his ilk) to say whether they feel that each of the following events is reasonable and necessary to achieve safer and/or less congested roads. Each of these events is similar to at least one which has happened in real life. Those who take exception to this post (despite no opinions being expressed therein, so I can't imagine why, unless they're trolling themselves of course) are encouraged to save everybody some time and not add their less than 2 cents' worth.

1. Location: a stretch of wide, straight urban road with compulsory cycle lanes.

Motorist A is waiting towards the middle of the road for a long line of oncoming traffic to clear so that they can turn right. Motorist B (with a line of cars behind) is coming up behind Motorist A and wishes to continue past Motorist A, so that neither Motorist B nor the cars behind are unduly delayed. There is not enough space to do this without going into the cycle lane. Motorist B checks carefully all around and ascertains that there are no cyclists anywhere nearby. Motorist B briefly enters the cycle lane to get round Motorist A and gets fined for doing so by a policeman who was observing from his car further down the road.

2. Location: a quiet stretch of urban road with a pelican crossing.

A Pedestrian presses the button on the pelican crossing, but then manages to complete the crossing and continue their journey before the corresponding traffic light turns red. No other pedestrians are nearby. A Cyclist cycles up to the crossing, observes that no pedestrians are going to cross after carefully checking, and cycles through the crossing while the traffic light is still red. The Cyclist gets fined for doing so by a policeman who was observing from his car further down the road.

3. Location: a quiet stretch of urban road with a pelican crossing.

A Pedestrian presses the button on the pelican crossing, but then manages to complete the crossing and continue their journey before the corresponding traffic light turns red. No other pedestrians are nearby. A Motorist drives up to the crossing, observes that no pedestrians are going to cross after carefully checking, and drives through the crossing while the traffic light is still red. The Motorist gets fined for doing so by a policeman who was observing from his car further down the road.

4. A stretch of fairly narrow urban road with heavy traffic including HGVs, and pavements alongside with no pedestrians nearby.

A Cyclist is finding it uncomfortable sharing the road with the heavy traffic, and after checking carefully to ensure that there are no pedestrians nearby, cycles on the pavement. They are fined for doing so by a policeman who was observing from his car further down the road.

5. Location: a stretch of urban road.

A Motorist parks with the car's bumper overhanging the beginning of a double yellow line by 10cm. The car is not obstructing or inconveniencing anybody. The Motorist returns to find a PCN attached to the car.

6. Location: a stretch of rural NSL road with double white lines.

A Cyclist is cycling down the road at 15mph. A Motorist comes up behind the Cyclist having been safely proceeding at the 60mph speed limit, and slows down to 15mph. The Motorist could overtake the Cyclist without crossing the double white lines, but to do so would mean going closer to the Cyclist than would be ideal (since the Cyclist is wobbling somewhat). After checking that there is no oncoming traffic for a sufficient distance, the Motorist briskly overtakes the Cyclist, briefly going around 0.5m over the double white lines to ensure that there is ample space. The Motorist is fined by a policeman who was observing from an unmarked car behind.

7. Location: a quiet stretch of urban road in London.

A Motorist stops for a minute on double yellow lines to read a map, so as not to obstruct anyone's potential path or sight lines. No other traffic is nearby throughout the time that they are stopped. A week later they receive a CCTV PCN through the post.

8. Location: a stretch of rural road through a village with a 30mph limit (recently reduced from 40mph). Going out of the village, all buildings, pavements and other hazards stop 200m before the speed limit changes from 30mph to NSL.

A Motorist drives through the village at 30mph, then begins to accelerate gently once the last hazard is 100m behind. The Motorist is doing 35mph as they are nearly at the NSL sign. The Motorist receives a NIP in the post a week later as a result of a hidden "Safety" Camera Partnership van lasering them at 35mph in the 30mph zone.